Transform What You Love Into a Scalable Business with Nathalie Doremieux

Transform what you love and do into a scalable business with Nathalie Doremieux’s heart-centered online business strategy.

Podcast: Play in new window | Download

Subscribe: Apple Podcasts | Spotify | Pandora | iHeartRadio | Podchaser | Email | RSS

When Nathalie Doremieux, an introverted online business strategist and smart, heart-centered mother of three, takes her clients by the hand to guide them through the ins and outs of creating a scalable business, she discovers an unstoppable drive to support women in creating financial stability.

“If you don’t believe in yourself, you can’t expect people to believe in you. You just can’t. You can’t fake it. People say fake it till you make it. You can’t. I don’t think you can. People can see through that.” – Nathalie Doremieux

Through her work with coaches and mindset work, Nathalie developed an understanding of her own strengths and weaknesses as an entrepreneur. Nathalie believes that in order to scale a business, one has to start by building an audience and experimenting with different techniques to reach the right people. She encourages entrepreneurs to focus on building a good rapport with their audience rather than feeling the need to sell them something.

On this episode of the Live. Love. Engage. podcast:

• How to Transform What You Love and Do Into a Scalable Business
• The Benefits of Doing Personal Development Work to Support Your Entrepreneurial Journey
• The Power of Building an Audience and Enrolling People Into Their Own Ideas
• The Value of Consistency in Growing Your Business
• Busting the Myth about Memberships
• Why it Pays to Lean into Your Zone of Genius

Connect with Nathalie
Website: themembershiplab.com

Quick Links:

• Join the Live. Love. Engage. Community
• Intuitive Business Coaching
• The Live. Love. Engage. Book
• Support the Podcast with BuyMeACoffee.com

Enjoying what you’re hearing on Live. Love. Engage.? Subscribe on Goodpods or your favorite podcast platform, and click here to leave a 5 STAR Review. You can also watch the conversation on YouTube.

TRANSCRIPT

Namaste. I am so glad that you have decided to join us for another edition of Live Love Engage. And I get to speak with some amazing people on this show, and the lovely woman whom I’m going to welcome here is no exception to that. So I’m going to tell you all about her in a second. But first off, I want to welcome Nathalie Doremieux to live, love, engage. Thank you so much for having me, Gloria. I am so glad to have you. We actually connected through email, of all things, because I’m on your list, but I’m going to tell people a little bit about what you do and why that kind of got my attention. So Nathalie is an online business strategist as well as a smart, heart centered mother of three wonderful kids and married to her business partner and best friend.

And she’s deeply passionate about memberships, online programs, and her clients’ success. And even though she says she’s an introvert, she is also unstoppable when she takes her clients by the hand, and patiently guides them through the ins and outs of online space and tech. And isn’t it amazing how I’ve always had considered myself an introvert as well? And yet here I am doing a podcast, but it’s from the comfort of my own home, which is good.

One of the things that we wanted to talk about today was how to transform what, you know, love and do into a scalable business. I mentioned at the start that we connected through email, and it’s because you were promoting your memberships and you were offering sort of a discovery call to see if memberships would be right for you. And you were so wonderful and thoughtful and just offered me some wonderful advice. And essentially, I’m not quite ready for a membership program yet, but I’m getting there, so someday you’ll hear about that. So let’s start off, I like to.

Find out from our guests a little bit about their journey. And so can you share with us a little bit what got you perhaps interested in doing online marketing and why you are so passionate about helping your clients. Sure. So I have a pretty unusual journey, and I should say we have. So, you know, I am in the south of France right now, so living in the place where we want to live, living the lifestyle that we want.

But basically, I met my husband during school. He’s today my business partner. And after school in France, we decided to move to the US. To live the American dream. We couldn’t really find a job in France.

We didn’t even look, but it seemed quite hard. And since we were in computer science, we decided to take our chance and go to the US. We go there for the summer, we find a job, great. We don’t, we come back. Well, within a month, I found a job.

So we stayed there. We got married in Reno, which is a little Las Vegas, just the two of us and our two witnesses. And we stayed there for ten years. We had three kids, and in 2005, we decided to sell everything and move back to France. And there were several reasons for that.

One was the lifestyle. I mean, living in California, in San Francisco was amazing, but things were going really, really fast. I was tired. I fell asleep at the wheel twice. One was on a bridge.

Bridge, yes. And we just could not keep up with that space. And one day my husband said, do you want to go back and say, we can go back for just two years? Well, it was in 2005 and we still here. We sold everything, moved back, and we were going to keep our jobs because we were in the Silicon Valley.

Computer science and the circumstances made it so that we didn’t get a chance to keep our job because the company got sold out. And that was then the opportunity to start a business. Now, the thing is, my husband is the entrepreneur, is the one that has ten ideas a minute. I am not. I like the todo list. Like I said, I am an introvert.

I like things that are safe, I like things that are planned. But I like to tell people that actually became an entrepreneur for love because I wanted to support him in his dream of being his own boss. So it’s been very challenging. I got fired twice by my husband because I was acting like an employee and not a business owner, like a co founder. But we’re here today and we’ve created this amazing business.

We’ve been in business for 16 years now, and it has evolved a lot. And we are getting closer and closer to really what we want to do, what we excel at, and where our zone of genius is. And that’s where you see the exponential growth. When you know that you’re doing what you’re supposed to do and you see the people’s transformation and results, it just motivates you to keep going further. So we started building software, trying to work with the French market.

Didn’t work, went back to the Americans, which was really the culture that we knew. We’ve never worked in France, so we’re here for the lifestyle, for the sun in the south of France and the beautiful house and the big land. But the business is really still pretty much in the US. And it’s through that story that realized that I love to support women and I like that safe space, that financial stability. I found that with memberships, it’s such a great way to create that recurring income that predictability.

I love to know at the start of the month exactly I’m looking because I have my money board. It’s a thing that I keep where I know when I start my month, how much I’m making already without doing anything. And that’s the safety that I need. Even though I’m an entrepreneur and I can take risks, that’s the safety that I need. And that’s what I’m helping people, especially women.

But we also work with men. I do attract a few men, but that’s kind of what I love doing. And that’s so important having that predictability, because so many, especially sole entrepreneurs when they’re getting started and they sort of get into this feast and famine sometimes and it can be very frustrating just to be able to manage your bills if you don’t know how much money you’ve got coming in each month. Can you share a little bit about what’s been your biggest challenge in that? Especially because you said that your husband essentially fired you a couple of times there.

So talk about that maybe. Yeah. My challenge again is really related to this idea of taking risks and decision making and trust, belief. I did a lot of work on myself, on my mindset, and I’ve worked with quite a few coaches and I was able to basically get to know myself, how I am wired.

For the longest time I thought I will never be a good entrepreneur because I’m not wired that way. Well, guess what? There are other things where that I can use that are really powerful. So I’m not going to communicate the same way. I’m not going to do things necessarily the same way as an extrovert that can get on camera and just shoot a live.

But there are other ways. So that’s what I learned. I learned what is my magic, what are the things that when I do that, I get the biggest impact. And when I found that, everything changed because now I get to delegate and surround myself with the people that can do the things that need to be done, but where I’m going to get a lot of resistance. So when you get to that point in your business that you can invest in that team, that’s amazing.

But I would say that the biggest thing is like the belief that you can actually do it. If you don’t believe in yourself, you can’t expect people to believe in you. You just can’t. You can’t fake it. People say fake it till you make it.

You can’t. I don’t think you can. People can see through that. Yeah, I agree with that because I used to fall under that line of thinking as well. But it really does make a difference in how you perceive yourself.

And so I love that you talked about the fact that you did work with coaches and you did do some work on yourself because that is I feel one of the main reasons why so many business owners either struggle or fail is because they haven’t done the work on themselves. Because you can have all of the wonderful marketing techniques and you can do all these wonderful things to be able to grow your business. But if you don’t have your mindset in a way that’s going to support you, it’s going to wind up sabotaging yourself, frankly, I think exactly. And it’s not something that you think you need. You think you need the next marketing tactics, you think you need the next tool.

But all these, I mean, you’ll see some people get successful right away and they have nothing. They have an awful website and they take payment, they don’t have anything. And you have people that are working on their website and their copy because it needs to be perfect and things like that. So that’s the tricky part, is people don’t realize the things that they try to avoid is probably the thing that they need the most. And that’s why it’s surrounding yourself with people that can show you that is really important.

Yeah, definitely. What would you say is the first thing, perhaps that a business owner needs to either look at or think about when it comes to wanting to be able to scale their business? So I think that when you want to so we are talking about scaling, so somebody that already has an existing business and is getting people some type of results. So maybe it’s working one on one. Right.

But there is already an expertise that you’ve established that you believe in. Now, how can I scale this? The first step, if you want to scale to one to many, have a bigger impact, reach more people, is you have to start to build an audience. There is no way around that. You have to build an audience.

That doesn’t mean you need to do Facebook ads necessarily. Right. There are other ways to build an audience and I can share with you how I’ve been building mine, but it’s really not about having a lot of people, it’s having the right people that are ready for your stuff. So I tell people when they want to do a course or they want to do a membership, I said, we can go into the tech and I can build you the platform. But the reality is, if you have nobody to sell it to, it’s not where you should be spending your time.

Right. So you need to build that audience. If you’re not able to attract people in some way so that they can raise their hand and say, I’m interested. Nathalie, tell me more when you have more information. If you can’t get people to do that for free, how do you expect people to actually pay for something?

Right? And it’s a difficult exercise for some people. It’s really hard and they get stuck there for a long, long time. But it’s necessary if you want to scale, because I love the one on one. It’s a great way to start.

When you want to work directly with people, to be super clear about who you want to work with and who you don’t want to work with, helps you get super clear on the avatar. But when you want to grow, this networking and one on one thing is not enough. Even the referrals, I still get the majority, I’m just going to say the majority of our clients from past clients or people that say I saw your link in the footer of a membership I am in and I want the same thing. It works, but it only gets you so far, right? If you really want that scaling, that making a bigger impact, that creating that community, that safe space for this group of people that you’re supporting, then you have to be a bit more strategy and have a marketing strategy to build that audience.

Yes. And it is important to be in front of the right people. And I do see the value in and I want our audience to understand that the value of working one on one not only is getting clear on who it is, but then you do have that opportunity to start getting results and so that then you can have the testimonials behind you. So that then when you start attracting or start widening your reach, then you’re going to be able to have that credibility behind you. What do you find is maybe one of the best ways to start reaching that broader audience.

Because I know for me speaking I found to be one of the best ways for me because in fact I was on a podcast not too long ago where I was able to make a paid offer and because people listened to me and they liked what I heard, they actually bought, which is a wonderful thing. What do you find or what do you recommend to clients or does it kind of depend on them? So there are actually many ways, but I think you really have to experiment with what works and what you’re able to sustain and do regularly. So for example, if you’re someone that loves to connect with people, like how we connected. I talk on my Evernote, I’m reaching Thousand Consultations, I’ve talked to like a thousand, Talk to thousand people in the last three years or something like that. This is huge.

But I love engaging with people like this. So if this is something that you like to do, then this is a great way to create that network and then see opportunities. Tapping into other people’s audience is a great way to build your own list because you don’t have to start from zero people. Of course people don’t know you, but you have some level of credibility already because you’re being introduced by somebody that you trust. So whether you’re being interviewed on a podcast or you do a workshop inside a membership, that’s something that I don’t look for them.

But when I am asked, I rarely say no and I don’t charge for it because to me it’s always an opportunity to get in front of an audience that is going to listen and get curious about the possibility of adding a recurring income to their business. And whether they do it right away, they do it later, or they never do it, at least they know. And I have achieved what I want to do, which is spreading the message that this is possible. So I never say no to that. But I also got clients from that because it’s a great opportunity.

If the person is ready, like we talked about, it’s not about the quantity. It’s like the right person at the right time that needs what you have. So one of the things that another shift that happened is that I used to hate selling because we hate the rejection. So we say, oh, I have to make the sale now. I never meant the sale on a call.

In fact, if you book a call and I don’t think I can help you or you’re ready, you’re never going to know what I can offer. I’m going to give you great advice, something that you can run away with. I mean, we had the conversation, but I’m not going to make you the offer because I don’t sell. I enroll people into their own ideas. So if they are not ready, I’m not going to present them with the thing that is not a fit for where they are right now because it has no purpose and they won’t take it anyway.

Right? So that’s basically the, that’s it.

I appreciate that. And there’s a lot of good value that you shared there that I think people need to take to heart. And I’m going to focus especially on this last bit about not feeling like you have to sell people when you get on these calls. Because as you said, even if you did offer it, number one, it was likely that they wouldn’t take you up on it. So then you just wind up feeling bad.

You’re like, oh, they didn’t buy for me. And even if they did possibly decide to, they might then change their mind right away. And so then because they’ll be realizing that, oh, this is something I didn’t want to do. And again, it’s going to just create more problems. Whereas if you don’t offer, then when they’re ready, they’ll come back.

And because they had a good experience with you. And I think that’s the most important thing is to be able to have that good rapport and leave people perhaps wanting more. Right? And we’re talking about just being ourselves and being humans and not being like the marketing bros that we see. Right?

And it’s really about just sharing, just showing up for the person, providing value. And then if you have a solution to a problem they have, I let them ask me, so what does it look like working for you? And when they do that, then I can shift into, okay, based on where you are this is what I’m thinking. We can do a strategy session.

We can do a deep dive, or we can go straight into building the platform because you know what you want, but we are not going to talk about that if they don’t initiate it. So the minute I made that switch, then it makes it so much easier now to have the conversation because I’m not about, oh, my gosh, I have to place my offer before the end of the call. No, it’s not that. If you show up and you show people you can help them and they can see how people always tell me, oh my gosh, you’re so passionate about what you’re sharing and like yeah, because I genuinely want them to see the possibility now, is it a priority? Will they ever do it?

Maybe not, but at least it’s there, right? One thing we should clarify, though, is you’re not necessarily telling people how to do something. Right? Because I know I made that mistake early on and then wondered why people didn’t hire me because I basically told them what to do and they was like, okay, cool, I’ll go do that.

Exactly. The idea is to tell them what I think the next step is for them. So, for example, if somebody comes and like, you know what? I am a coach and I don’t want to do one on one anymore. Some women come in like a second stage of their business.

Let’s say I’m 50, so I’m 51 actually. So I tend to attract women that have been in business for a while and they’re like, you know what? I want to slow down the coaching, but I don’t want to slow down my income and I want a bit of time back. What would that look like? Because people need me.

People need my expertise. I am the one that has to deliver. And that’s where I have the most powerful calls because I get to show people that we can unpack this system, this method that they have that works. And they really need about 20% of you, so you get to show up, but in a way that’s leverage the rest. Things where you keep repeating yourself all the time and things like that, it can be taught in a different way online.

And when people realize that, then that’s when things, you know, really start to shift. Yeah, I can, I can say that for sure. And it’s it’s a wonderful thing when that happens. I’d like to find out from you what’s a commonly held belief, maybe regarding marketing perhaps in general, or sales maybe, that you passionately disagree with?

A belief that I disagree with, that you have to be everywhere and that you have to do the videos and that you have to do the pointing, even if that’s not you. I don’t believe that. I think that there are people that are really successful that you don’t hear about. What we see is the people that are showing up, but they are not necessarily the only ones that are successful. So thinking that you have to do the thing, if that’s not you, that’s something that I disagree with.

I like that. Yeah. It’s so easy to get caught up in just seeing what other people are doing and feeling that you have to do the same thing. You can model some of the things perhaps that they’re doing, but it still has to come through from you. It’s got to be still your voice, because people will recognize when you’re just being somebody that you’re not.

Exactly. People do business with people at the end, they really want to see why you’re doing it more than the thing that you’re doing. So it’s really important that you show up authentically. So if you want to do videos but you don’t want to wear the makeup, you don’t want to wear the lipsticks, you don’t want to be all dressed like some are, you don’t have to actually. It’s not you.

It’s really going to look fake. So it’s really important. I think that I remember I was really disappointed. We were in a Mastermind and there was this guy, isn’t in France. I’m not going to mention the name because it doesn’t matter, but he was telling how successful he was on YouTube and how now every time he writes to the list he makes some money and things like that.

And then he said, but you can’t do that anymore. It doesn’t work anymore. So we got 30 minutes of, oh, this is how I did it. Oh, no, it doesn’t work anymore. So because that’s the thing, there are trends and everybody does the thing, and then it becomes, oh my gosh, it’s like Challenges, Summits now.

It’s paid workshops and we start to see Summits again coming. Right? So you have to follow the trends, but you also have to make it fit to your business, your values, and what you stand for and make sure that you can be consistent in showing up. High value showing up. Yeah, that is absolutely the key, is that consistency.

I know when I’ve done, like, early on in my business, I was consistent in blogging. I was blogging every week, and I got clients as a result of it. Then life happened that I did some other things and got away from that. But I’ve been doing the podcast now. I’ve been doing this consistently because it’s something that is a joy to do for me.

And at the beginning, I wasn’t getting a whole lot of downloads, but now it’s picking up because I’ve been consistently showing up and doing this now for almost three years. So it, it does take some time. And I know a lot of us, especially here in the United States, where we want things happening fast. Like you said early on, when you were living in California, everything was so fast and rushed, and at the same time, we do need to have a little bit of patience and realize that some overnight successes take ten years. Exactly.

There are strategies that are short term and then there are strategies that are mid term, long term and you need to have both. Right. You can work on the short term. You can be interviewed on a podcast or inside a membership. You come up as a guest expert, you do a master class of the month.

There are a lot of memberships that are looking for content like this, but there is also the ongoing groundwork of showing up. And actually that’s one of the things that I could not be consistent in. And I am a technical person, so I can do Canva, I can do blog, I can do all that stuff, but I’m not consistent because this is not really something that I enjoy doing. And I hired a social media manager and now she takes care of that and I tell her, hey, I’m getting on this image, this is the communication, the emails, or I’m doing this. And then she turns that into content that we can share.

So it’s really about you have to be consistent, whatever strategy you choose. It’s that consistency where people can start to say, I keep seeing her because they’re not going to engage at the beginning. They might not necessarily right, but it’s that consistency where they see that you keep showing up that shows authority, basically. Yeah, definitely. What are you curious about right now?

Well, I’m curious to see how the online business world is going to be impacted by what is going on.

I don’t know what’s going to happen this next quarter. It’s been really, really interesting. It’s been super quiet the second quarter. People like waiting in, I’m going to wait, I want to do it, but I don’t know. Then summer starting to pick up and now September is where people are waking up.

So that’s something I’m curious about is like how as business owner we are going to be impacted and how people are going to be able to see opportunities. There are always opportunities when there is change. And I think there is definitely an opportunity for people through memberships, creating safe communities and things like that. So I’m curious to see how that unfolds. Before I finish, let me ask you, what is it specifically about memberships that you like the best?

I think it really started from this idea of when you work with somebody, say you’re a coach or you work with somebody and then when your time is up, it’s goodbye. So several things happen then. One, they’re going to go somewhere else for the next step because you’re not providing it. Two, you’re leaving money on the table and it’s costing a lot more money to find a new client than to continue to support someone. In fact, anybody that is a coach that is doing one on one coaching or group coaching or that is teaching painting in the local thing can start the membership because they have the expertise, right?

And they can scale that expertise. So it’s about continue to help people that you’ve already supported and providing that support. One thing that really that I don’t like is when you see all these people that are selling online courses and they show you the success as the money that they are making. The success of a course is not made by how much money you make, it’s made by how many people are successful inside and that you don’t see. So when they make seven figures, sure they can find 100 people that did it and got result, but how many thousands got nothing and no support because they hop on a call.

But it’s always the same people, the extravagant that always have a question and things like that. So membership is a way to provide ongoing support and accountability so that you can actually do the thing. So I love back end membership which are memberships that go after course because it puts the pressure off of saying I need to do this within these 9, 12 weeks because after that I don’t have support and therefore it’s going to be another thing I bought and I don’t finish. Most people don’t finish online courses. I think it’s like 3%.

I know. If you say I have a course but then if you need extra support, I have an ongoing community where we can continue to support each other. Don’t you think that gives credibility to your program? Don’t you think you have more people that will be successful and you add recurring income to your business? It’s a win win for everybody. So that’s why I love this power of ongoing.

A membership is an ongoing solution to a recurring solution to a recurring problem. So people will stay as long as they continue to get support, accountability, so that they can get the result. Either they are learning something, they are building something or they go through a physical. I have people that have lung disease, PCOS, also it’s a safe space for them to talk about nutrition and exercise when you have those ailments right?

So that to me the power of a membership, it’s like as a business owner, this is such a great way to leverage that expertise to create a bigger impact because you can impact thousands. There are lots of membership with thousands and thousands of people where you really don’t have to focus on oh my gosh, how do I bring in the money next month? You focus on how can I continue to help them, how can I improve the experience inside, what can I do if people feel overwhelmed, right? How can I make it more engaging? How can I help them track their progress?

There are so many strategies for retention and things like that once you’re in it, once you’ve built it. So that’s what I love about membership. And I’m guessing and you can correct me if I’m wrong here is that as you were saying, you’re wanting to be able to help people to do like the next step. Now if the next step is something that you don’t have necessarily expertise in, that’s where you could bring in somebody else who may be different, right?

Yeah, absolutely. So I tell people I don’t have a big list so I’m not going to teach you or coach you on how to build a list. This is not my place, this is not my expertise, my zone of genius. I build my list through networking and through past clients and referrals. So that’s how I do it.

So if you need to build that audience, I can give you some pointers but I cannot coach you on that because I don’t feel I am equipped. However, if you have the audience, like if you have lots of followers, if you have a list, it’s active or you have past clients, then I can help you do something with that. So of course I will tell them I would either direct them to somebody or if I see this is a mindset, I can refer them to some friends that I know work on that kind of thing as well. Well I appreciate that because I do think that sometimes is where people may get tripped up and thinking I have to we sort of talked about this. I think that was one of the things you said is that everybody has to be everything to everyone or that you have to be everywhere.

So stick to your zone of genius I think is the important thing. Important lesson here. Is there anything else that I should have asked you about that I didn’t that you’d like people to know about? Well, there is a myth about memberships that maybe we can talk about because a lot of people start with are afraid about how long it’s going to take and the tech, the tech scares people and actually you see that we didn’t even talk about the tech.

Absolutely. Because the tech is just implemented and I am a technical person. Okay, that’s what we do, we build. But before we build we get really clear about what the offer is and what is this minimum viable product that we can start selling as a beta so that we can get some money, get lots of feedback and then you can grow it some more if you want to add more features. So the myth is really to start with the tech.

When I see somebody online and they say oh, I want to start a membership so what’s the best membership platform out there? It’s like asking what’s the best car? And then you have people replying, oh you need to use this, you need to use that. This is amazing. It’s like if you are asking I need to buy a car, what’s the best car?

And people start saying the cars that they have or that they sell. But they don’t ask you if you have children, if you plan to have children, if you have dogs, if you live by the beach, if you live by the mountain, if you need a four by four. They don’t care about what you need. They just sell you something that I know is good for them and you get only more overwhelmed. And a lot of people give up because they start with the tech.

They pick a platform and they start to work the platform, learn the platform, not their zone of genius, not what they should be focusing on. And they try to figure out their membership model at the same time. So they’re trying to do two things at the same time. Learning the tech, which could be draining all their energy depending on how they’re wired. And they’re trying to figure out what they should do.

So they start looking at what others are doing and start copying instead of putting blinders on and say, okay, what am I good at? What is my solution? What’s the transformation? How can I turn that into a program? And if you don’t know, that’s when you talk to people like me, and there are others that can give you a strategy on how to break that down, but the tech is what overwhelms people. [00:37:44]

And then they are like, oh my gosh, I’m going to have to create a lot of content. It’s not about more content is not equal to more value. Actually, more content creates overwhelm. If you can give them the result with less content, even better. People don’t buy videos, they buy the result, right?

So the easier you make it for them to get to the result, the better. But people don’t see that. They’re going to go straight into writing a curriculum, doing tons of video, or doing two hour long videos. Because it has to be that long. No, it doesn’t have to be that long because you won’t get the result. Right. It has to be a way to break it down.

And that’s because they don’t have the process to create that program. So it’s really like being aware that you really have to figure out what your next step is. And very often it’s not the one you think. Absolutely, this has been so wonderful like I knew it would be. You’ve shared some really great strategies and things for people to really think about.

And I think that’s the important thing is to don’t feel that you have to rush into anything, but do some thinking, do some planning, as you said, figure out what is it that you have to offer first, and then you can figure out what’s the best way to be able to build a community around it. If someone has been listening to this today or watching us on YouTube and says, oh, I need to work with Nathalie, she’s definitely, that’s who I need to talk to. What’s the best place for people to connect with you? So the best place to go is on our website. It’s themembershiplab.com, and there you’ll be able to book a call, look at our portfolio if you want to be inspired.

We also start to have some case studies that you can look into, and that’s basically the best way to reach out. And don’t hesitate. I do still free consultations. I know some people say you shouldn’t. Well, I learn so much from these consultations.

It’s a two way thing. It allows me to see where people are, what stresses them, what struggles they have. So that’s why I continue to do them. It works for me. Like I said, I might not go with the grain.

People say you need to charge for your time. No, because I’m getting a lot of market value from that. Absolutely, yeah. Whatever works for you is the important thing. Exactly.

Kudos to you for doing that. Well, thank you so much for spending some of your evening with us today as we’re recording this. I really appreciate it and I wish you continued success in the future. Thank you so much for having me, Gloria. And I want to also thank all of you for watching and for listening.

I do so appreciate you. And if you receive value today, I encourage you to share this episode with a friend. And I will have Nathalie’s link to her website in the show notes as well. So make sure if you forget, go to liveloveengagepodcast.com and you’ll be able to get that. And so, until next time, as I always like to do, I like to encourage you to go out today and every day and live fully, love deeply and engage authentically.